Is there a chance we can get UNICODE support?

jamesuk

New member
Hi,

my family lives in Japan, and whenever they want to edit local recordings, they have to change the filenames to non-UNICODE names to be able to even open them in VRD.

Would it be possible to get support for UNICODE filenames in VRD?
It would make things a lot more convenient.

AAC support wouldn't hurt either btw :)

jamesuk
 

Danr

Administrator
Staff member
Sorry, no unicode support in this or the next version (TVSuite).

Regarding AAC, are your files program or transport streams? Maybe you can upload a clip to our FTP site.
 

rejc22

New member
That's a shame, I was really interested in buying your program.
But it's a bit embarrassing in 2008 not to support unicode, and quite a hassle to have to construct menus out of bitmaps.

-Richard.
 

SnoopyDog

New member
So guys, will you finally grant us VRD users, who speaks languages with many special characters, full Unicode support? As i have understood v.5 is right around the corner, although as it seems heavily postponed. Perhaps that is due to Unicodification of VRD? 7 years now since this first request and still waiting. Keeping my fingers crossed for a positive response :)
 

SnoopyDog

New member
Yeah, I kind of suspected that. I guess its futile to ask if there is a new ETA for the Unicode feature, most developers hates answer ETA questions anyway. Anyhow maybe you recently had the opportunity to do a more precise assessment of how much work and time it will take developing it, so I ask the question either way?!
 

Danr

Administrator
Staff member
Actually I feel bad about not having unicode support out-of-the-box for V5, it's been on the V5 road map since day 1. It will be coming, I just can't say when. In the meantime, we need to get V5 out to everyone first so we aren't doing dual maintenance on both V4 and V5. Adding V5 Unicode on top of that as well would bring things to a crawl.
 

SnoopyDog

New member
Yes, it sounds like very sensible decisions. Thanks for the happy news, very uplifting :) Maybe the wait wont be too long then.
 

SnoopyDog

New member
Actually I feel bad about not having unicode support out-of-the-box for V5, it's been on the V5 road map since day 1. It will be coming, I just can't say when. In the meantime, we need to get V5 out to everyone first so we aren't doing dual maintenance on both V4 and V5. Adding V5 Unicode on top of that as well would bring things to a crawl.
Any news on the matter? Its been a long time since you were doing dual maintenance, yet still no unicode support to show for.
 

Dan203

Senior Developer
Staff member
It's a major undertaking. DanR tried to hack something in so we could support unicode file names without having to convert the entire product to unicode, but it failed. Converting the entire product to unicode is the only option and there is a LOT of code that would need to be changed to make that happen. Not to mention a couple of 3rd party libs we use which are not unicode and would need to be replaced. While it is still something we really want to do, I'm not sure when we're going to have time to actually tackle it.
 

SnoopyDog

New member
It's a major undertaking. DanR tried to hack something in so we could support unicode file names without having to convert the entire product to unicode, but it failed. Converting the entire product to unicode is the only option and there is a LOT of code that would need to be changed to make that happen. Not to mention a couple of 3rd party libs we use which are not unicode and would need to be replaced. While it is still something we really want to do, I'm not sure when we're going to have time to actually tackle it.
Yeah right...probably never! Sorry Dan203, but this is old news. This must be VRDs greatest embarrassment not having unicode support 2015...a huge let-down given the request is now 8 years old. I would be very ashamed having a request on the to-do list that long and not bringing it home (no matter how major the undertaking appears to be). Can we expect it in 2020 maybe? Typical for american programmers making the unicode stuff harder than it really is. Newsflash...IT'S NOT THAT HARD :cool: V5 seems to be fairly stable and has reached a mature status, this is a great time to start hacking away. The start is always the hardest...the conversion will go smoother along the way as the knowledge increases.
 
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Dan203

Senior Developer
Staff member
I honestly don't know when, or if, it will happen. The effort required to make the transition compared to the benefit provided is not currently enough to make it a high priority. DanR made some promises earlier based on a hack he thought he could make work without converting the entire product to unicode, but it failed. Now we know the only option is to convert the entire product. While you may think that's "not that hard" I can assure it is, at least for us. VRD is a large product and we are a small company. (2 developers) This would require one of us at least a month, maybe more, to convert. That would take us away from our normal duties with regards to support, bug fixes, etc.... because during the transition the product would be completely unbuildable. Then there is the issue of 3rd party libs. We use a few libs in VRD which are not unicode and which have long since been abandoned by their original developers. So we'd have to replace those and all of the code that uses them. (I think this is even more of an issue then converting VRD itself)

I understand this is a big deal to you, but in all honesty we get maybe 3 complaints a year about this. In the scheme of things it is a very minor issue. And the amount of effort required to fix it is disproportionally large compared to what it would actually provide to our users.
 

SnoopyDog

New member
Ok no respect left...shitty attitude to something that ought/should be fundamental/basic for all good software and you dont see/realize it = shitty and convenient/lazy programmers = shitty product
Its the easy road to wish it would all blow over somehow, but this one will haunt you many years to come. There is a lot more threads than 3 a year where people are having trouble due to the unicode issue, but they do not complain and buy in to the crap you are feeding them. Got to find something better and stop bugging you guys. You must be exstatic having lost me as a customer...im probably up there amongst the most difficult ever...so F U Sirs
 

Dan203

Senior Developer
Staff member
Not sure why this turned to insults. I was just trying to be honest with you. There is a reason this keeps getting pushed back and I was trying to help you understand that reason. You may not like it, but there is no reason to insult us.
 

BDGillard

New member
Got to find something better and stop bugging you guys.



Snoopydog,please let us all know about this software that does all that VideoReDo does, and supports unicode. I haven't found it yet
 

SnoopyDog

New member
Not sure why this turned to insults.
Just terribly fed up with you guys after 4 years of waiting and nothing to show for.

Got to find something better and stop bugging you guys.

Snoopydog,please let us all know about this software that does all that VideoReDo does, and supports unicode. I haven't found it yet
Are you kidding? What do you think VRD is based on...the FFMPEG of course, which has been unicoded since ages. Its just a hassle to use.

Good bye!
 

phd

Super Moderator
VRD is NOT based on FFMPEG.

FFMPEG is a recent addon only and is NOT the core engine.
 

tobyW

Member
Food for thought

Hey SnoopyDog (and anybody else interested in this problem),

I agree that unicode support can be easy! But let's think about this a little...

It's only easy, if a project like VRD is made unicode-aware from it's very creation.

Let's remember, though, that back in those days the average softy (like me) had hardly even heard of unicode, let alone considered writing the code in a unicode-aware fashion.

Once the software has been written, converting it to be unicode-aware is no mean undertaking.

I know this to be true, because I was involved in a similar excercise in a small team, some years ago.

In my case, I recall that we, too, looked for a quick fix at first, but the result was misery. So, we had to grasp the nettle and do the job properly.

I recall that we were faced with trawling through every line of code in the entire project, converting strings to wide-strings, converting string function calls and parameters to their wide-string counterparts, dealing with non-unicode interfaces to external libraries, and so on.

Then we trawled through it again to inspect it, then we tested every dark corner of the code before letting it loose on an uncompromising public, with possibly some new bugs.

As I recall, it took several man-weeks just to do all that, not to mention the overhead of managing the release and fixing resultant problems etc.

And while we were doing it, the software was unbuildable, we had no time to answer questions, and we were not working on other items on the wish-list.

I don't know whether the same difficulties would apply to the VRD team, as I don't know what programming language and environment they use. (Mine was Visual C++)

Anyway, SnoopyDog, I'm hoping now you might join me in allowing a little sympathy for those hard-pressed developers at VRD! Thanks!


Hey you developers,
- Congratulations, on continuing to support VideoRedo and improve it, so many years after its birth.
- Commiserations, for not thinking of unicode when first creating the project!

TobyW
 

SnoopyDog

New member
Hello TobyW!

I hate being mean to people and of course I have a bit of sympathy for the guys. Both Dans are otherwise doing a great job on a great software, but unfortunately this matter has been handled appallingly bad. I have been involved in unicode converting projects myself and know how timeconsuming and tricky it can be in some cases. I don't know much about the conditions of VRD or how large it is and how tricky it might be replacing the external libs. What I know is they had a golden opportunity to unicode V5 from the very start, which also was on the road map from day one, but they didn't seize it and decided to release the beta prematurely. Ending up with having to endure dual maintenence on both V4 and V5 beta making the conversion completely impossible to fit in. Quite bad choices if you ask anyone doing software development. The reason for this mess is the usual one (greed) they probably needed new money in badly and in doing so delaying unicoding the software indefinitely. DanR even said so himself some posts back, feeling bad for it and he really should. Now I doubt this great software will ever be unicoded. It's definitely not going to be easier the larger the software becomes and the longer they wait.
What's annoying me much is the VRD company are trying to peddle the software all over the world in non-english speaking countries, without letting the customers know about this problem (deceiving). It comes as a very unplesant surprise and the customer is left to work around it in their best ability. Although this is no major issue if using dlflannery's VAP (he takes care of the problem for you) or know yourself around scripting and programming.

End of rant:cool:

SnoopyDog
 
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